Wherein Cam is amused at fic descriptions and ponders OTPs

[misscam]

So, a friend passed on a link and rather amusingly, I found various fics of mine rec'ed and described as "good but too old school, not in line with current producers' vision of D/R. Not shippy enough" and "Definitely of the brand of Doctor/Rose fic coming from the Old Skool, which tends not to see D/R as an OTP by any stretch. Which always makes for very, very *interesting* fic, if unsatisfying and occassionally annoying."

So after I stopped being amused being classified old school when I can count on one hand the number of classic episodes I've seen and having not been in fandom even a year, I got to thinking about OTP. And the thing is, I'm not sure I believe in OTP at all.

Yes, I believe in love. And I believe sometimes you find someone who seems ideally suited for you and it is genuine, heartfelt, I'd-die-for-you kind of love. However, under different circumstances and at a different time in your life when perhaps you never met that first ideal match, I think it's possible to meet someone else you might feel genuine, heartfelt, I'd-die-for-you kind of love for. Humans - or Time Lords, for that matter - adapt and change with the people we love. I don't think there's just one shot at love out there. However, once you found one of them, it could be the right one for the rest of your life and you don't need any others.

Rose meets the Doctor. In doing so, she changes. Later, he changes. I choose to see their relationship as love. But if they had never met, do I think they wouldn't ever have loved anyone else? No, I don't. In fact, I don't think Rose is the first one the Doctor has loved or will love. It doesn't demean their relationship to me, really. Just like it doesn't demean my love for my father that I also love my brother, you know? Love isn't a restricted quality.

Of course, you can have conflict with loving more than one and fidelity tends to be a good idea. Nothing's perfect. Certainly not love, which fucks you over and comes for repeats when it feels like. But it's still fascinating and human and neccessary. And sometimes, when you've found and lost it, the really brilliant thing is that you might get another shot.

So, I don't really believe in the soulmate OTP part. But I do believe in love. Quite a lot, actually.

Maybe that makes me another sort of old school.

Comments

[canadian-kazz.livejournal.com]

I'm compelled to agree with you. I also believe in love, but I'm not dead-set on the idea that there is only one soulmate for each of us. Loves come and go, but they never really leave you. You will always remember them. Rose and the Doctor will never froget each other, but ultimately thay will both move on. The Doctor will find more companions and Rose will find new loves. Prehaps she may even get back with Mickey. He certainly still seems interested in her.

So prehaps I'll join you on that old school bus. ;)

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

The idea of soulmates has to be one of my most hated concepts. Seriously. And I am not fond of OTPs either - there are pairings I like, and those I like less. And that's it.

...Which is why when I say "lulz shippers!" what I always mean is "lulz OTPers!" I just don't see the point of OTPs.

[aervir.livejournal.com]

I might be mean, but I do wonder what this person you link to, with her strange view on relationships and TRUE ETERNAL DEEP ABIDING LOVE, will make of episodes like The Girl in the Fireplace or the mortgage scene in The Impossible Planet once she watches season 2...

And there are some people in real life, who meet someone, fall in love, get together and have a predominantly happy relationship for the next 40 years. Wonderful for them!

But to project a similar ideal onto a fictional relationship where one partner is, um, 900, sometimes a bit fucked up, and has the attention span of my little nephew on bad days, while the other one is 19 and sometimes rather immature....? Uh-oh. Um, no.

[mahala.livejournal.com]

However, once you found one of them, it could be the right one for the rest of your life and you don't need any others.

Don't know that I believe in soulmates, if only for the simple reason that even when a person is blindingly in love, they still need others. One of the worst tragedies to see is a young couple so smitten with one another that they ignore the rest of their friends and fail to make new ones. When the chemical high wears off -- and even for the deepest, 'soulmate' love it will, if for no other reason than the aging of bodies -- they are alone.

And I'm not just talking about fraternal love. Happily married couples still get crushes on movie stars or even 'real people'. It's just a human trait. Fidelity is all about how you handle the attraction, because it will happen.

Yeah, yeah, I know, this is fiction, and silly things like organic chemistry shouldn't get involved. I guess I have a bit of trouble suspending my disbelief.

But yeah, finally getting around to the point here, I agree with your assessment.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Dunno if Mickey will be right for her, though. He will always be the guy she left for the Doctor for. On the other hand, he might also be the guy who understands. So who knows, really.

Plenty of space on the bus - I'm service ice cream on the road, so hop in. ;)

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Heh. I tend to take shippers more as people with a preference for a certain pairing. Which is why I'll call myself a shipper easily enough. I do have my preferences, oh yes.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

*shrugs* Things can look very differently if you just tilt your head a bit. That's perspective and interpretation for you.

30 years for my parents ;) But yeah, you should always consider circumstances at least when drawing your conclusions on a relationship. Some do overcome huge obstacles and pull through when you were sure they'd never manage, but a lot fall by the wayside as well.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Humans are social creatures, yeah. We go in packs, even if we partner up as well. So yeah, agree with you that something beyond the love of your life is needed. If not while the relationship works brilliantly, at least when you hit trouble.

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

I think it might come down to the fact that while I will read, discuss, meta and even (very rarely write) for a whole lot of different ships, I don't consider myself a shipper at all. I am just a person who happens to like certain ships. I know it isn't the common use, but I classify people like you as someone who likes a certain ship as, you know, someone who likes a ship, and shippers as being only those who tend towards OTPing (ie. Liking the ship to the exclusion of other factors)

It's probably a stupid way of expressing myself, and has got me in trouble at times, but it's just a weird quirk of my reactions to fandom. Possibly highly biased by f_w, of course. I always associate "shippers" as being the crazy ones. Other people who like the ship are just... people who like the ship, if you get what I mean.

[belegcuthalion.livejournal.com]

My dear, tat's the kind of old school I can definetely live with... and one of the things that annoys me more and more concerning OTP's in the LOTR-fandom. I understand pretty well that someone falls in love with a pairing, but that you create wanks and animosities towards people who have other ideas. And love is flexible... thank God.

[harmonyfb.livejournal.com]

Too 'old skool'? ::dies laughing:: Yep, cause those old skool writers always had the Doctor & his companions fucking like bunnies. /sarcasm

And anyway, Rusty knows that the Doctor's OTP is Romana. ;)

[anitchka.livejournal.com]

I'm confused as to why she's rec'ing fics left and right, and then saying, "Oh, look at this! Except it sucks because of A, B, and C." I generally rec fic that I ... don't think is sucky.

[belegcuthalion.livejournal.com]

My dear, tat's the kind of old school I can definetely live with... and one of the things that annoys me more and more concerning OTP's in the LOTR-fandom. I understand pretty well that someone falls in love with a pairing, but that you create wanks and animosities towards people who have other ideas is sad and sometimes even frightening because it becomes increasingly bizzare. And love is flexible... thank God.

Sorry for the comment-makeover - it is so hot over here that I have great difficulties to concentrate. Thus some sentences of mine are meandering into the distance these days...

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Oh man, I had enough of that in CSI fandom. Shipper wars left and right. It gets very exhausting and just feels restrictive. Ugh.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Now there would be a raunchy show.

Not true! The Doctor's OTP is the TARDIS! You're all blind and silly if you don't see that, like. /sarcasm

[jonquil.livejournal.com]

Not shippy enough? WTFWTFWTF???

There are people who believe that Perfect Love is a perfect shield against sorrow, loss, change, and anger. Avoid such people; most especially avoid falling in love with them. For one day, they will discover that even True Love doesn't do much when you have a migraine headache and have just lost their job, and they will question the nature of their love instead of saying a few choice words. I have true love. It's hard work. It doesn't keep away pain or anger or old age; it simply makes it easier to cope with them when they come.

You don't have to be Old Skool to know the Doctor isn't emotionally monogamous -- what, precisely, were these people thinking during "School Reunion" and "Girl In The Fireplace"? I'll tell you what they were thinking. They were thinking La La La This Isn't Happening.

My mother once said to me that I was romantic but not sentimental. I think that describes you, too.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Well, you can like fics you still have some issues with. But yeah, made me scratch my head a bit. It's not what I'd normally start saying about a fic I might want others to read.

Ah well.

[harmonyfb.livejournal.com]

Not true! The Doctor's OTP is the TARDIS!

I bow before your obviously superior logic. ::forcibly prevents self from writing Doctor/TARDIS porn::

[misscam.livejournal.com]

I get what you mean. It's just not the usage I'm used to, you know? I guess I tend to use the phrase "rabid shippers" about those quite, quite OTP about it all. Shippers are those who like the ship, as opposed to the more gen-minded.

Funny how words can vary so in definition by who's using them, huh?

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Oh so tempting, innit?

IwillnotIwillnotIwillnotIwillnotwriteTARDIS/Doctor

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Heh, perhaps. I certainly don't believe in fairytales and happily ever after. If you're lucky, I think you can get mostly happy most of the time. That's my aim, anyway.

But there's always going to be some shit happening, and it helps to keep your eyes open if you want to manage through.

[yattara.livejournal.com]

Huh, that more or less sums up my latest thoughts about love. The guy I'm with is a Great Love, not the Great Love, of my life. I don't really think there's only one person for you out there: what if you miss that one? It feels so restrictive.

[beck-liz.livejournal.com]

OK, first of all: "Old Skool"???? She must not have actually run into anyone who's actually Old Skool if she thinks that.

Secondly, "not in line with the producer's vision"? What crack is she smoking? Or what alternate universe is she from?

Thirdly, although I am all over the Doctor/Rose (or Doctor/Rose/Jack) like white on rice, I've come to the conclusion that I do not really believe in OTP - at least not the way she seems to mean it. I mean, I tend to prefer not to read the Doctor with anyone but Rose, and I absolutely prefer fics where the ending is happy (but won't necessarily stay that way), but that's my preference. It doesn't mean that I think she's the only one he'll ever love forever and always. *facepalm* The romantic part of me, admittedly, does wish that were so, but I'm too realistic to go with that notion even in fiction. In fact, that sort of drippy soppyness usually makes me roll my eyes and hit the back button.

[shandydann]

I'll tell you what they were thinking. They were thinking La La La This Isn't Happening
*sniggers*
As an old skooler myself I enjoyed the series.

I tend to think folk who believe in soulmates are a touch nieve. But that's 'cos I'm bitter and twisted.

I suppose it's easier for people to project how they would feel though the shipping. You're right about the true love thing it's hard work and your true love has to work just as hard.

I was a bit bemused at the reviewers comments.

[jonquil.livejournal.com]

My husband and I agree that our 25 years of marriage have included the happiest 23 years of our lives. ;-)