A fandom sigh

[misscam]

And this week on Doctor Who fandom - Is it about racism, is it about ship, is it about personal grudges?

Whichever, it's already made it to a wank report, though anyone posting it is likely to get grudge-wank stamp, so who knows.

I have friends on both sides - or all sides, I should say, cos there's more than two sides at work here - so I'm just gonna stay in the wankshelter and have a drink. Anyone who leaves their fandom at the door is welcome to join me, whichever opinion you might subscribe too.

I will say this, though - Me, Saz and Michelle do try to keep time_and_chips an all right sort of place. We actually do care about it. If we don't always do something you agree with, there are over 2600 other members too and perhaps considerations you are not aware of. But if you do want to say something, we do have Page-A-Mod, which works well enough that other comms have adopted it, I might add. Feel free to say something there, if you want.

Now - can I take your order?

Comments

[padawanpooh.livejournal.com]

I'll have a double...no...make it a triple.

*headbar*

Have you got some peanuts too?

I'm just rejoining T&C: I originally left because the posting volume was so humungous and I thought a smaller comm would be easier to keep up with. But I see that it has calmed down a lot from post-S2 and whilst the mods were always good, knowing you're keeping a weather eye out is reassuring.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

I got enough food and drink in here to keep everyone going through the Wankalypse, if needed. Peanuts are an essential component. Salted?

Yeah, with no new episodes the posting level at T&C has gone down, of course. Probably easier to mod nowadays than it was back in the day - I don't envy the mod at the time their job. Yowza.

Sorry you got dragged into all the hoobladoo - lots of grudges at work that don't really involve you :(

[yattara.livejournal.com]

I am completely lost. Can I get a beer?

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Of course. Dark German kind, perhaps? Fandom sounds like it needs it.

[wendymr.livejournal.com]

I have friends on both sides - or all sides, I should say, cos there's more than two sides at work here

Oh, me too. Me too. I'm currently hitting my head hard against my desk, because I just can't believe that this shit is still going on. Mostly I avoid it, and then I'll get my attention drawn to a discussion I really didn't want to see. That's why I'm only in a limited number of communities and almost never read LJs beyond my flist. I'm happy in my own world of continuing to read and write fic about my ships (combinations of Doctor, Rose and Jack) and at the same time continuing to watch the series.

I don't want to be made to feel guilty for continuing to watch the series now that Rose is gone. I didn't want to feel guilty for liking Martha at the start, and I also don't want to feel guilty for finding her irritating by the end and wanting her to leave for her own self-respect. I don't want anyone telling me that I should 'move on'. I also don't want anyone telling me that it's disloyal to the ship to have friends who don't like the ship.

*bangs head repeatedly against the desk*

Can I have a triple. Please?

Oh, and I agree with padawanpooh: time_and_chips is a lovely place to hang out :) Yes, occasionally a post or a fic will be a little more slighting of Martha than I like to see for fairness' sake, but the real bashing gets deleted.

[wendymr.livejournal.com]

On the fic side, it occurs to me to wonder if some of those who seem to think that people who still write Doctor/Rose and in particular write wish-fulfilment reunion fics all genuinely do want it to happen that way in the series - maybe that's why I see comments about wanting to undo forty years of history or bring the character of the Doctor down to a human level, or worse. Maybe I'm just weird, but when I write shippy fic I'm completely capable of separating the universe of that fic from the reality of the episodes on screen, and I can write a completely AU wish-fulfilment Doctor/Rose fic while at the same time enjoying new Rose-less episodes. The fact that I'm not interested in writing Martha doesn't mean that I hate her. It just means I don't feel I know her character and motivations well enough.

And, likewise, just because I write romantic fic involving Rose that doesn't mean that I'd hate to see the Doctor happy with another companion in the future. If Martha had turned out differently I might even have been cheering that relationship on, even at the same time as my writing still focused on Rose. But then maybe I'm just weird.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Triple it is. With a complimentary little umbrella you can poke people with if they try to drag you into wank.

And thanks :)

[drakyndra.livejournal.com]

It's really, really bizarre seeing Time and Chips criticised for being too, what, oppressive? Or something. I mean, I left ages ago, but that was down to my whole sick of hearing about Rose thing, rather than the modding.

I feel sorry for carlanime. She's on my flist, but as far as I know not hugely involved in Doctor Who fandom, and suddenly her reasoned criticism of one of Nos's more provocative posts (even if I agree with Nos on the fundamentals, I'll admit the post was a bit of a poke at some people) gets a wank invasion in the comments.

She's just been thrown head first into a rather old and vicious debate. Poor dear.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I think I pointed out to Nos the rather obvious poke. I've certainly had my disagreements with her as well, but that is to be expected when some of our opinions collide. The T&C jab was... Well, not unexpected coming from who it was coming from. Not the first time either, so opinion duly noted.

It's definitely grudges and unfinished business that is bringing the wank to it all. People not familiar with fandom has to be scratching their heads like whoa.

[crackpig.livejournal.com]

Now - can I take your order?

Touch your toes!

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Pfft. That is easy. Try to touch your nose with your tongue, that's more fun.

[ashestothestars.livejournal.com]

*leaves all fandoms at door*

Gimme, the largest and strongest thing you've got. For once it's not the Who fandom that's getting up my nose and I need the strongest thing in the shelter to wipe it from my mind.

The only reason I'm back in T&C is that you and your co-modlings keep the comm relatively calm and are decent and fair mods. I left it for almost a year before the current mods were appointed.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

I got something with a worm in, will that do? The worm looks like it died quite horrified, quite frankly, so it might be strong enough.

[malaleen.livejournal.com]

Honestly, I do think T&C is well modded, but considering how fandom has utterly destroyed my enjoyment of Rose in any manner, I left for my own sanity.

As for your wank shelter, I'll join up as not only is all this shipping/race wank giving me a headache, the imminent HP wank-apolis is scaring the crap out of me.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

the imminent HP wank-apolis

I love the term "potterdamerung."

[spockette.livejournal.com]

I have friends on both sides - or all sides, I should say, cos there's more than two sides at work here - so I'm just gonna stay in the wankshelter and have a drink.

YES. *enters wankshelter, also*

Fandom is scary sometimes.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Not just DW one either, from what you've shown me.

We needs lots of colourful drinks and possibly spiked jello.

[siraj.livejournal.com]

*downs a shot of whiskey* I'll say this, I lurk on T&C, looking it over now and again... and I think you've done one bang-up job of keeping that place orderly.

Now could I get some sake? and leave the bottle?

[misscam.livejournal.com]

You should poke out now and then ;) T&C loves a male.

But of course. I'll have it served by a kilted fellow at your convenience.

[marcasite.livejournal.com]

I have friends on both sides - or all sides, I should say, cos there's more than two sides at work here - so I'm just gonna stay in the wankshelter and have a drink.

The irony is I like Martha, I like Rose, I like Donna and I co-mod a Doctor/Rose community and I love it all! I am a huge shipper of Doctor/Rose and can wistfully (in the back of my mind) wish she would come back but its not the end for me.

I was reading some of the comments and its nice to hear that some people who left T&C are thinking of coming back.

Mojito, please.

[neadods.livejournal.com]

I quite miss T&C. I know that Misscam and the mods to a fabulous job, but I was starting to get hypersensitive, and I've been through one fan war. When I recognize myself starting to fall into the warrior patterns, I knew I had to go before I was the one starting the problems.

And I'm quite looking forward to going back. I certainly intend to; I had a great deal of fun there and expect I will again.

[honorh.livejournal.com]

I got slightly wanky about it myself, primarily because I have a hard time buying into the "If you 'ship X pairing or like Y character, that's because you fit in Z category" thing. Sweeping generalizations annoy me. But I've resolved to steer clear of whatever it is from now on.

I'll take a strawberry daiquiri, and keep 'em coming.

[falena]

I only lurk at T&C (and not very often, may I add), because fandom really ruined my enjoyment of Doctor/Rose as a pairing, but from what I could see it's well modded. I mean, you kept the place under control (and the batshippery mostly out). What more can somebody ask of a community?

As for wank, I have no real (intelligent) opinion on it. I'm just glad I've taken to saving pages from many DW BNFs journals, so that I can compare stuff (in a vain attempt to judge objectively) when things get wanky and f-locked.

Fandom is serious business. And there's only less than a week to Potterdammerung. Scary!

I'll have a strawberry caipiroska, thanks.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Oh, everyone has their different ideals for a comm, you know. The bigger it gets, the more ideals you get. Sooner or later you get some crashes as well. YTDAW has had some of the same issues, I think.

You sound like a historian, heh. But yeah, there are many different perspectives to keep in mind.

Less than two weeks till I come too! :)

Mmmm, strawberry.

[platypus]

I have friends on both sides - or all sides, I should say

Me too, and I find it very sad to have people I like sniping at one another. It's too easy to fall into generalizations, and I've seen nastiness coming from all sides (though not, thank goodness, from all people, and that's why it's so dangerous to think everybody's toeing some party line).

I still happily read T&C, and it seems quite well moderated indeed (the exact thing that made me wince this morning has already been addressed, and the comments on it so far are entirely sane and reasoned). I'm just exhausted. There are so many things I love about this show and its fans, and I'm reciting them quietly to myself.

I could use a mild tranquilizer and a Coke...

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Yeah, quite a bit of sniping going on. And passive aggressive stuff with sudden bursts of not-so-passive-no-more. I really think it's been building a while. I know I have a few things I'm just dying to rant at people, but it will probably lead nowhere good at all.

I know of which post you speak, and we have indeed dealt with it.

Very easy to forget the show itself in all this fandomness, innit? Maybe I should have a marathon of Episodes I Love at some point, see if it helps.

I got a tranquilizer gun I got ready in case we get invaded here - you want to borrow it and shoot yourself up when you need?

[--kali--.livejournal.com]

*sends you extra tequila* I've got loads spare and I think you'll be needing it, the shelter'll be filling up.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Yarr. Thank you. By this stage, I'm going to need trucks to load in enough alcohol here.

Mmm, tequila...

[witchqueenrat.livejournal.com]

To dust off a cliche, this is why I stay away from all my fandoms. If even "Johnathan Strange and Mr.Norrel" is getting into the wank, what hope is there for anyone else?

Still, there is good in the world. http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2007/07/13/1183833772710.html?from=top5

[neadods.livejournal.com]

Do I even want to know how Jonathan Strange can be wanked?

[aka-paloma.livejournal.com]

All that made my head hurt. I've never understood the DW 'shipping wars seeing as "romantic" relationships with the Doctor have never been part of the canon. I don't include the fact that some characters like Martha and Tegan were in love with the Doctor. It was unrequited and that does not a romantic relationship make.

Am I wrong to just enjoy DW for the travels through time and space? Does this make me a freak? Were Old Skool Whovians this batshit crazy about Four and Romana vs Four and Sarah Jane Smith? *wails* Things were so much easier when I was twelve and watching DW repeats and loving the show for its interesting story arcs and the "internet" was mostly being used by government and educational facilities! I think I'll just hunker down with my evil!OTP and pray for daylight.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

Back then, there was not the Internet to gather up on and breed the special kind of batshit you see in groups (see Harry Potter fandom, ship group batshittery therein), I think.

Everything was easier in life when one was twelve. Sniffles.

You are not a freak. Probably, you're too sane. *pats* Lots and lots of drinks?

[teh-nos.livejournal.com]

Exhaustion -> ranting -> end of serrius bizness. I hope. I may have to go slashy for a while but I WILL TRY HARDER. I be torn between the urge to dump my one true love, and the urge to read boyslash about Time Lords. It's exactly like trying to solve the Middle East. All people who ship Doctor/Master hate all women. I know I do.

Also, Torchwood.

[misscam.livejournal.com]

I still no like Torchwood. I cannot feel the love.

Maybe DW fandom needs some Oslo accordes. Ones that end up working, at least.